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Changing Mormon Conference Talks - Page 2

Have there been any comments from Elder Poelman about this?

Ironically, LDS_forever just started a Thread about going back to the basics.

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I think it is important not to exclude the word "programs" in this statement. It gives a totally different meaning when considered. As mentioned by many, the Church's progam have changed many times, often made less detailed. This in order to give the members more time to spend with their families. So, I don't think he meant we will eventually outgrow the Church, but the Church programs, or at least less dependent on them.

Let me give you an example:
I don't remember exactly when, but Church meetings were organized completely different than they are now. There were two meetings on Sundays, and other auxiliary meetings on weekdays. Maybe we needed that then, but the members generally needed to mature and take more responsibility for themselves and their families in keeping the sabbath day. In this way we could say we outgrew some of the programs.

Maybe when Christ returns we will not need the Church as known today anymore. But until then I believe we will need it, and not outgrow it.

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Actually, I do not see why this was changed. If it were to read with 'programs' added...

Then I can see that as a direct adjustment, but actually the two snippets are saying two different things rather than 'fixing' what he said. Maybe our wise English guru FarSeer can give some thought into the English usage here?

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Ok, lets try again...

What elder Poelman said was that we as members will become less dependent on Church programs, meaning that the programs would be altered to be less time consuming (IMO).

I can only guess the change in the text was made because it was a fear that the members would think they could relax and not do their part at that time. The changed text says that we will be more effective and better to utilise the Church so that our lives would be more gospel centered (and not program centered). And that's a good thing and is exactly what is happening, or should happen. This is why I don't see this as a direct contradiction to the original text.

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Yes, I understood what you were trying to say the first time, but the change in text is actually saying something different. Remember what was meant to be said and what is said is a matter of interpretation.

Changing Mormon Conference Talks

He did not say that, that sounds like your interpretation of what he meant. He was clear on his statement. Compare the two and you will see the difference.

Changing Mormon Conference Talks - Page 2

Then I can see that as a direct adjustment, but actually the two snippets are saying two different things rather than 'fixing' what he said. Maybe our wise English guru FarSeer can give some thought into the English usage here?

In my opinion, (and I'm not sure it has to do with language usage) it does mean two different things. Growing out of the Church progams is just a "given" if we are continually progressing. Sooner or later, our children outgrow Primary, the youth programs, YSA, etc., and move on to more mature programs, such as Relief Society, Elders Quorum, High Priests. Someday they may have stake leadership callings. Bishops may become Stake Presidents, who often move on to become Mission Presidents, who become... what's after that? Many people outgrow the programs of the church because they must in order to progress.

Is it at this point that they then more effectively utilise the Church to become more gospel centered? I would think, and in my own opinion, that once we have progressed spiritually beyond a certain point that the Church is no longer a tool to help us. Once we have experienced the deep spiritual experiences necessary to progress to that point, we actually become those who teach and lift others.

I agree with Valla that the church is full of spirtual children (myself included), and that the main function and purpose of the church is teaching those the steps necessary to progress beyond the "milk" of the gospel. Personally, I think that people in general have become less mature than in prior generations, having been spoon-fed everything we are "supposed" to know from birth onward; it's no different in the Church, and with very few exceptions. Researching for ourselves things we want to learn is too much trouble for most people anymore, even with the wealth of knowledge at our fingertips on the Internet and elsewhere.

However, once we reach that point where we thirst and hunger for knowledge, beyond what we are learning in Church, we have to do the research for ourselves. Hopefully, at this point we've become attuned to listening to the still, small voice that leads us and guides in what, where, and how we should go about it.

Again, all in my opinion.

Changing Mormon Conference Talks Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 2

The men who give these talks are far from perfect so it is expected that you will get imperfect talks as well. If they had reached the level of perfection where they made no mistakes they would not be here with us.