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LDS View: Transsexuals - Transsexual Mormons - Page 4

Hello Laurie. Is it correct to assume that the sisters in Relief Society are not aware that you was born male?

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This is so true. There is a famous case where a boy baby was born, and there was an accident in a surgery that the baby needed, so the doctors told the parents of this child to raise him as a girl. Long story short, it didn't work, he(she) felt different then everyone else, found out that she was born a boy, and still to this day she/he has psychological problems from the ordeal.

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I wanted to share on this subject because this is something that hits some what close to home. 5 years ago my sister came out and told me she was gay. Now I know that its not exactly transexual but it comes almost on the same lines. In a disscusion we had when she " came out of the closet" she told me that she has finally came to grips with something she has struggled with ever since she was little.
Now I can understand why she went that way and I blame it on our upbringing. We pretty much grew up in a broken home with several issues. Mom died when we where young and dad was always gone working 7 days a week. Before she left home she was very active in church and was dating a lot of young men. Also went to BYU.
She got in contact with family we haven't seen in twenty years and moved in with a cousin who isn't active. Pretty soon my sister started drinking and other things and then I find out that she's gay.
At of all of this, and what I'm trying to convey, is that every one of us had to grow up and deal with some thing that we had to struggle with and each personal struggle is genuine- no doubt about it. I have seen in this world that people find things to believe in and find what ever they believe is right. What it all comes down to is what is your final destination? DO YOU BELIEVE THAT EVERYONE WHO DIES WANTS TO GO TO THE CELESTIAL KINGDOM? If an individual wants to receive celestial glory I believe they will do what ever in their power to conform to the gospel to get there- the pearl of great price if you will.

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It may be easy to say something like that from the distance. I believe Heavenly Father analyzes every circumstance in a person's life before passing judgment, we as humans don't do that. Sometimes people have psychological issues that impair them from making some choices, it is not that they don't try harder enough or they don't want to go to the celestial kingdom. The reality is that we don't have everything figure out as we may think.

Edited: Liahona on 19th Dec, 2009 - 5:33pm

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Well I hope you don't think that I was saying that it's pretty easy to just change. In what I posted earlier I mentioned that we have difficulties in our lives- things we struggle with. There are things I struggle with but I know that I need to do my best to overcome. If I'm not doing this best I can in my capacity to repent I know that thoughts about entering the celestial kingdom becomes questionable.
Here's my reasoning in a nut shell. We are all talking about transsexuals. There are those who believe there is nothing wrong with it and there are those who defend it. In the Book of Mormon when Alma was a priest under King Noah they lived a life that they believed that there was nothing wrong with what they where doing. Read the part where they drag Abanidi in. They glorify the king and talk themselves up. They pretty much say that they are following god and are doing right. Alma eventually woke up and realized what he knew he needed to be doing to enter into the rest of God. Even risking his life in the repentance process. There was alot he had to deny himsef of what he was doing previously. Alot of changing. Even Alma the younger was doing everything he possibly could to right all his wrongs and it was a difficult and painful process of repentance. All sorts of people believe in all sorts of things that to them is right and correct. Transsexuals believe that they are truly meant to be that way. So with Gays. Marine boot camp is meant to drill into ones head ( and successfully) that they are a tool of death and there are marines that believe that, even when they get out of the military. There are some that believe that was just there sole purpose of life.
All I'm saying is that if one wants to be baptized and believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ they will do what they can in there capacitys to conform to the gospel through repentance. If they want celestial glory they will go through ( for several if a lot) the long, tedious, and maybe even painful process to be celestial worthy. But if there are people who are ok with being transsexual and other things like it and think its fine then their destination is a different glory. And as I said " DO YOU THINK THAT EVERYONE WHO HAS DIED ON EARTH IS GOING TO WANT CELESTIAL GLORY?". Remeber Laman and Lemuel. There are people like them out in this world. Those two saw an angel, heard the voice of god, and other manifestations. All those things didn't do much for them. They had a mindset and determination to the end.

LDS View: Transsexuals - Transsexual Mormons

I suppose I have a problem with your assertion of who goes to which glory based on your own mindset.

First of all, let me clarify I do not condone someone living the life of a transsexual or homosexual but I think all of us will be surprised of who makes it to the celestial kingdom and who doesn't.

For some reason, some people think that just because they go to Church every Sunday, fulfill a calling and they don't drink or smoke, they suddenly can "make it" to the celestial kingdom, but they don't take care of the sick and the afflicted and feed the hungry and help the needy (home teaching/visiting teaching, the biggest issue in church, I wonder why?).

I know a transsexual man who raised (on his/her own) ten children of mothers who abandoned them. Those children right now are productive members of society and "she" is one of the most caring mothers I've ever met. Will she be judged for her choice of being transsexual? I'm pretty sure she will as well as each one of us and the choices we have made but let me tell you that I also think she will be rewarded according to her fruits. So I tend not to generalize so easily of who will make it to the celestial kingdom and who will not. Only the Lord in his infinite wisdom will determine that, there is no way for us as humans to know that for certain... hence, we should all try to love one another and support one another in our many weaknesses and afflictions rather than thinking whether someone is making enough effort to reach there or not.

Who knows my bishop may not make it, but this person raising 10 kids will. That's the wonderful thing about the Lord, he looks at both our acts and our hearts AND he is fair. Again, I think we will truly be surprised who will make it... Therefore, I will not go as far as to say transsexuals won't. In my opinion, of course.

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There are some things I agree with you. Just because some one is a member of the church it doesn't mean in an instant in to celestial glory.

I also understand that members of the church do need to definitely have charity to be with them. Visiting the sick and helping others. Understand though that many a calling has to deal with the well fair of others- thus helping the poor and visiting the sick.

I also understand that it is a members responsibility to stay on the path of contiual repentance. That which I'm trying to do my best to stay on.

But I also know that as members of the church we have a duty to share the gospel, to cry repentance, and to help others to enter into the straight and narrow gate-baptism. And to continue to encourage them to stay on that path.

When I was a missionary I held a position where I was in charge of a group of missionaries and when they had people to be baptized I had to interview them and, according to the spirit, determine whether they where ready for baptism. I loved that position because I was able to see the desire in these people willing to live the gospel and it helped to strengthen my testimony. I hope you understand that people willing to live the gospel want to conform. They want to receive the blessings promised to them in the scriptures. There is a special, sincere feeling in those meetings. A wonderful spirit.

It frustrates me that we live in times where we have to discuss things that in the scriptures and even modern day prophets has told us to stay away from, to not partake of, to not encourage. Yet we live in a time where people are discussing acceptance of these things, at times demanding acceptance. People are taking what is black and white and making it grey which is not good.

If I held that position again as I did as a missionary and a guy sat before me dressed as a woman I can tell you that person is not yet ready for baptism. But if that same guy sat before me, dressed as a guy, and expressed a sincere desire to follow the gospel ( even though he may still be struggle with his issues while seeking baptism) then one would be ready for baptism.

He doesn't have to be Christ status! He has to be sincerely trying. It doesn't mean easily succeeding.

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Marchman is your sister a member of the church? Sometimes young women go through a phase in life of experimentation. I was wondering though why you brought this up here since transsexualism is where the person identifies with a physical sex that is different from their biological one.