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Donald Trump - Page 61

The main fact that he stated is that it takes two sides to fight. IF the leftists were not there counter protesting then you may not have had any violence. Remember Violence begets violence. The fact that the others came armed with clubs and other weapons shows you that it was not going to be peaceful.

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Agreed, they both came looking for a fight. Here's the thing, the radical left can do that because they know the press will favor them and make it look like the right started things.

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The neonazis showed up with body armor and rifles. Even accounting for media bias, I wouldn't call a few bats on the other side an escalation. I'll concede the left were looking for trouble, I'll willingly declare many of them should not have done what they did. But the bottom line is nothing they did warranted a literally murderous response.

Regardless, the main problem I have with Trump's second response to this is not that it was technically wrong (Which it was not), it is the context in regard to his other expressed stances. He has made a political career out of blindly ostracizing particular groups that his fans love to hate, and blaming them wholesale for various problems, usually with a blatant disregard to the truth.

Along comes an incident with one of the very very few groups in the world that almost no one would object to him giving the political middle finger to as seems to be his usual bent… and all of a sudden he's calling for people to consider both angles on this?

I have on several occasions heard it said that punching Nazis in the face is more of an american tradition than baseball. For someone who defends and protects the rights of all peoples reasonably consistently, defending Nazis in that regard as well is understandable, difficult to see, but it is a continuation of those ideals. For someone who defends and protects the rights of NO ONE ELSE...

Edited: daishain on 16th Aug, 2017 - 12:04pm

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Did you all see that press conference with Trump giving off the cuff answers to journalists? He basically defended the white nationalists and said there were "Nice people" there. These are the same people who dislike his Jewish son in-law and grand children and yet he finds them "Nice"? Since Trump has come to power the white nationalists have grown and they continue to grow. We are back to the era of cross burning in the 50s.

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I saw what he said and the press like always is trying to take a this tid bit and that tidbit and running with it. Yes there were nice people there but that does not mean all were nice so running with that is not correct either.

It is my belief that when a group gets a permit to protest and have a demonstration that you should let them have their say even if you feel they are wrong. Do not come out in groves and attack them and turn a peaceful march into bloodshed and other negativity. Last I looked we still have freedom of expression in this country. All sides need to learn this and adhere to it.

Saying we are going back to the 50's with dross burning and total hatred is also wrong. The news media has been doing a outstanding job at defeating America from within by getting everyone against everyone else. Our great nation can not fall to a outside invasion as we are too strong together. The only way to defeat America is from within and that is exactly what we are allowing to happen. As long as we keep being divided we will fall. The saying of "United we stand United we are strong. Divided we are weak Divided we will fall", is more true today that it ever was back in the 50's.

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Ya know KN, you are spot on there. Now I'm that last person who is into conspiracy theories… but it sure seems like the press is complicit in trying to tear our country apart. They only take one side, make it seem like the other side is full of saints and victims and the other side is evil incarnate. The truth is there are good and bad people on both sides. But you would never know that from the press. It makes me wonder…

Donald Trump - Page 61

There were people there who just think the statues should stay. They weren't nazi's or members of any white supremacist groups. Those were the people that Trump was talking about. He wasn't saying that there were good people in the nazi groups that were there.
There is a growing trend in this country of people wanting to quell speech that they don't agree with. I'm ashamed to say that most of this is coming from the left with terrorist groups such as Antifa. The whole point of freedom of speech is to protect speech that people don't agree with. If a certain type of speech isn't allowable then who decides what is allowable? What if in the future someone decides that what you say isn't allowable? All speech must be protected.

The saying in the past was " I might not agree with what you are saying but I will fight for you to have the right to say it. Now it is turning into " I don't agree with what you are saying and I will fight you to stop you from saying it. " The very people that decry fascism from the alt-right etc are acting in a fascist manner. Beating people up at rallies for having differing political opinions reeks of the brown shirts of 1930's Germany.

I know I need to have a disclaimer because people don't understand that I can support someone having the right to free speech while not agreeing with that speech. I think that Neo-nazis are disgusting and I don't agree with what they espouse.

Edited: Kyrroeth on 17th Aug, 2017 - 8:31am

Donald Trump Politics Business Civil & History - Page 61

All,

I hate Nazis. My uncle fought them in WW 2. They are evil. Every word they say is anathema to me. I despise white supremacists. Their outlook is disgusting. They couldn't be more wrong. However, I defend their right to spew their vile crap. In fact, I defended it for my whole career and still do.

They all didn't go there with the intent in killing someone, one of them did. Maybe ten of them did. He's been caught. Some of them went simply to defend a statue.

What President Trump said was true and he's being castigated for it. There were people there on both sides who went there with ill entent. He didn't say anyone deserved to die on the other side. Quite the opposite in fact if you listen to his statements rather than press' mischaracterization. More, as the chief executive it is his duty to protect the speech of the minority, even if it's repugnant.

There was a time when freeing the slaves was a minority point of view and it was repugnant to over half the country. But the speech of the people against slavery was protected. Many of those people were freed slaves, but their speech was still protected.

Someone mentioned that President Trump made a political career out of blindly ostracizing groups his fans love to dislike (Daishain maybe). Well, so did President Obama. I remember his speech about fat cat bankers with their private jets. Hm, lets ostracize a group of Americans for working hard and being successful so he can play to his base.

The press didn't crucify him for that. Yet he picked on a very small segment of the population. In fact, it's such a small segment it deserves protection from the Government, not being ostracized. Even though they have wealth, his words made them vulnerable. And what's more, the vast majority of them don't have private jets, they simply have pretty good jobs that afford them a good salary that they worked hard in school to get.

Furthermore, when some flipping butcase took a rifle and started killing police officers in Dallas, hard working people with families, he never said terrorist. Why? That sure sounds like terrorism to me and it spawned a bunch of copycats. Yet he actually took the other side to a degree and talked about how this is understandable due to recent events with police killing African Americans. His Attorney General was even more blunt on that point. Where was the outrage then?

President Trump isn't saying let's consider both sides. He isn't saying, oh pitty the poor Nazis. What he is saying is both sides were wrong. I happen to agree with him. There were people in the left there to make trouble. There were people in the right there to make trouble. Both sides were wrong and it led to tragedy.

We are going down the slippery slope of silencing dissent in this country. I don't like what you say, I'll call it a micro aggression, whatever the Hell that is, and make you stop saying it. That's what the left was there to do.

Look at our campuses. My God, you can't say anything on the right side of the political spectrum without those kids rioting. What, hearing a different opinion hurts their ears? Maybe hearing a different opinion hurts their frail constitution or ego? Whatever it is, we are setting them up to either be really crushed when they get to the real world or to change the very liberties I grew holding dear.

We are in a sorry state. The press is making it worse. I fear for my country.