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How Many Have An Actual Relationship With God - Page 2

Ammon,

I see that this post did not go over well, but about as much as I had expected, but had hoped other wise.

If we do not have the Holy Ghost, we are left to only rely on the Arm of Flesh, which God many times has warned us to avoid. But when member don't, have the Holy Ghost in reality, that is all they are left with, to follow the prophet. Brigham Young warned us too, he worried if we become so confident in our leaders, they could lead the people astray; but worst of all, the saints would not learn to develop a relationship with God and Christ, which is essential to reach Exaltation.

Faith = the Holy Ghost = Salvation/Exaltation.

No Holy Ghost = no revelation = no Salvation/Exaltation.

My sheep hear my voice, those that do not hear my voice, are not my sheep; Joseph Smith, Lectures on Faith

Without the Holy Ghost, no one can approach me and my Father; thus saith the Lord to me.

The rats are not leaving the Good Ship Zion, the meek saints of God are, as the Good Ship Zion sails on, heading toward a rocky shore that will sink it; this is the time of the separation of the sheep from the goats.

If anyone has the Spirit, they well feel it, by reading and pondering what I have had to say.

Edited: DavidLJ on 14th Mar, 2016 - 12:49am

God Relationship Actual Have How

I am coming to the conversation late, but I agree with DavidJ. During Joseph smiths time we grew as a church in spirit, revelation, knowledge and doctrine. Sine Joseph smiths time that grow has slowed to a trickle. That's a fact. The question is why?

How Many Have An Actual Relationship With God Studies Doctrine Mormon

Are you wondering why the Spirit in the Church has gone to a trickle, as a fact, to catch the interest of others, in hopes they might do more then glance as this thread topic ? I had wondered for decades, but now know, as explained some in my previous post. The Lord has shown more vividly, that those who do not have the actual Holy Ghost, do not follow men, but him; people follow the men, because they don't have the Holy Ghost, if they did, they wouldn't. It seems so simple now, as the Lord enlightens my mind, but years ago, the curse had not been lifted yet; I ask some, have your eyes been opened, in the Book of Mormon it is often referenced as scales of darkness.

Everyone falsely believes that first comes Baptism, Gift of the Holy Ghost, and you have the Holy Ghost, but that is not correct; you have to earn it. One more note, during Joseph's time, only one in the high priesthood, who had seen Christ, had the right and power to even give the Holy Ghost; there has not been many of those, and not really any it seems in the Church higher leadership; they no longer claim to have seen Christ, yet they supposed to have, to be a Prophet and Seer; so there you have it, the blind leading the blind.

If anyone wants a really good read, if they have even a trickle of the Spirit, read 1 Nephi 8, and plus; the warnings of darkness and all of the Wo's, are for us Gentile Mormons today, not any other people, who have not read the book.

Maybe you know the why, it took me decades to understand it, slowly as the light came to me by the Spirit from the Lord. It was part in case, from the fact that even before Joseph's death, the Lord had placed the Church under a curse, for rejecting the more plain and precious truths, that Joseph Smith tried to teach them. In effect, Joseph gave his life for the Saints, to give them a second chance; as the lord had told him to flee to the Rockies and the safety of the Lamanites, there to build up Zion there; that plan failed, Jackson County MO, was no longer the place.

The curse was just lifted not long ago, again the Restoration is beginning to take off, fired up by Denver Snuffer. When I read his things on the Book of Mormon, they align totally with what the Lord has been slowly showing me for the past 40 years; so it was nothing new; but he does add the icing to the cake, and puts into words, and provides church documentation, to support his words; that was why he was excommunicated, for showing the actual history of the Church, from their own records and histories.

The Lord has shown me personally that those who Joseph called Friends, were some of the very ones who were party to his death in some form and fashion, and complicit with the mob who killed him and Hyrum.

All of the Presidents of the Church, from Brigham Young to the early 1920s only claimed to be President of the Church, not a Prophet and Seer, that only began really, under David O. McKay and later. As much as the leadership would like to say, they have the keys and the Spirit, they do not, the higher Priesthood and many of the keys stayed with Joseph, as Hyrum was set to be his replacement and he was killed before Joseph. So the Church lost a lot, including the power to affect change jun the Saints to be Zion; ever wonder why Zion has been so long in coming.

Brigham Young, in his last journal entries, was still waiting to receive the Mantle of Prophet and etc, but it never happened.

The Restoration that Joseph started, is now awakening, but not in the LDS Church, but those Gentiles and Remnant who are waking up and being kicked out for it; now is the time to complete the Restoration.

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DavidJ. I absolutely agree with you. We are to follow the Spirit, and we are to follow our leaders if "They" follow the spirit, not just because they have a position or authority in the church. I love truth. I am not afraid of it. I am not afraid to stand up for it. I investigate where the spirit leads me and then use the spirit to determine truth and look for a second witness and verification of truth by confirmation through scripture and or modern prophets or both. Truth has lead me to Denver Snuffer too. I believe the "Gospel" is true… the church I examine much closer, and do not accept cart Blanche. There are things that bother me. I just don't see the Savior investing 2 billion in the city creek center. Some people think that is wrong, or dangerous or on the road to apostasy. Here is how I answer that.... .. In a word, "INIQUITY". The Nephits fell to iniquity throughout the Bookk of Mormon. It is a lesson we are to learn or we will fall too Also.
Jacobs lecture at the temple was to a people that were beginning to labor in iniquity. They wanted to justify having more than one wife on religious grounds. They were trying to justify taking a wife of men that had been killed in combat, after all that's the righteous thing to do right?mtake care of the poor widows? Wrong! The Lord knew their and Jacob knew their heart. He knew this would lead to the exact thing that King David did in sending Uriah to the front lines to be killed so that he could have Bathsheba.

Iniquity in most Book of Mormon terms means righteous people's embracing untruth as truth. So for example, take a doctrine and morph it over time into an untrue tradition or doctrine and bingo, you have good people embracing an untruth with great religious zeal. Even casting out people from the church because they do not believe the the untruth. Wow talk about a great strategy Satan employs.... .Good people, believing untruth as an establish authorized church doctrine, that then fight and cast out people that actually do know and believe the truth.... .this has happened all throughout history.. The only solution is to call a prophet to call the people to repentance. Unfortunately because the people follow men and tradition (And not the Spirit, and confirm the witness by either scripture or modern prophets or both) they will reject him most of the time.

God Relationship Actual Have How

Talking about King Davids OCD about the sexy girl on the roof, and her husbands death planned. I was horrified by some of the stories that Denver Snuffer pulled from Church History; over a Bishop who wanted a girl, that was to belong to another; this regarding multiple wives. He first tried to threaten, then tried to force the young man to go on mission, that did not work, and eventually with some men, killed him, by cutting off his private parts, and let him bleed death. If am remember this right, he also took the knife hung his cut off parts on the wall of the School house I think, therm held a meeting, to tell the other saints, those who did not follow him, something similar could happen. Guaranteed, not all leaders were liken that, but things happen like that, when men feel they have absolute power and or can get away with it.

It is easy to see, this man did not have the Holy Ghost. You are correct, Lucifer twists a truth just enough to take away their ability to receive the Holy Ghost, and their exaltation, without them knowing it; there is verse in the the D & C or in Book of Mormon that sets forth that very example.

Nice to find someone on this site, to see the light, who has had their eyes opened and the scales of darkness pulled off; I have been chumming the waters with my bits of truth for some time now, trying to find others and or wake others up.

This twisting of God's truth just a hair, to chain those who will listen, down to hell, has been Satan's go to best methods for a long time, for anyone who has really read the Book of Mormon and Bible.

I have no idea why most people would rather listen and follow someone then get it directly from the Source; unless they don't have the faith, to walk into the darkness to find the light. I guess it helps when you have never trusted authority ands others, being impaired by ADD and etc. I sort of think too, some of it comes from bring Irish, Scottish and Native American, and always on the wrong end of the stick in life. The Lord does allow trials in our lives to bless us; I don't like them, but I am still thankful for them.

Over time, it has culminated in the thought process, that people follow people, because they don't have the faith, to gain the Holy Ghost, to follow God and Christ directly. When one sees how A = B, it makes things so much clearer; have always love the idea of KISS, and keeping things simple.

Most of what Denver Snuffer has said, that I have read, and I have read 75% of this writings or more, it is all a second witness to me, from what the Lord has confirmed to me too over the decades; I have just never been able to put it into words like he has.

How Many Have An Actual Relationship With God

DavidJ. Once again I agree with you and have experienced a lot of what your talking about. It's hard to find people that are interested in the deeper things of the gospel, and even harder to find ones that get it right. Degenerate does both. I have been considering being baptized, but only want to do it if it is done by someone that has actually seen and received power from the savior personally. I believe Denver has. I tried contacting their fellowship to learn more but didn't get a response. I have a feeling it is pretty close knit because of possibility of persecution.

Yes, I too have read most of Denvers books, and I even bought the 40 years in Mormonism on cd before it was offered for free on his blog and YouTube. I know he is a good man and I believe him and his testimony of personal visitation from the Savior.

I believe truth no matter where it comes from, I am not scared of it, however I am very aware that I can be deceived, so I weigh things out pretty well before acting. I am still weighing wether to be baptized. I think the issue for me is if I could be baptized by someone that has personally received the power from the Savior.... .. .I would be interested in your thoughts. It seems we are on the same path on many thing.

I appreciate you taking the time to reply to my posts, thank you so very much.

How Have Actual Relationship God - Page 2

Nice to find a kindred Spirit.

DS says, that a father can Baptize the members of his own family, and etc,, but to go outsider of that, then one should have the sustaining of at least 7 women, including his own wife, if they have one. My local friend accomplished that, while at the Colorado Conference that someone planned this last winter. He is the one who will be doing mine, we are fairly close friends, also my Chiropractor. He was going to move, but decided and felt he should stay here for a while, and start a Fellowship, as there are few of us here in this area of Central CA. In UT and ID they have quite a few Fellowships and some are fairly large.

My fiend also, when he went to England to pick his son, ready to come home from his mission, he baptized a couple and their son there, before returning home. He also talked to his son's mission president, and what he learned of Snuffer words, sounded good, and may switch.

Anyone that is doing baptisms, should be able to show you there certification, if you will, for a better way to put it, you might find one near you, if you belonged to a [..], there are more, but I don't have the time and energy for more.

I emailed DS one time, and he never respond, but then what I asked about, the Lord and reading more of his books, answered the question. I have to assume he is very busy, or at least, wants some privacy. DS has said, basically what Joseph said, teach them correct principles, and they govern themselves. That is what most seem to be doing, reading his words, learning from the Lord, then following the Lords guidance. DS does not want to be a Prophet, even though in essence he is one; but he wants those who believe, to seek Christ and learns for themselves, and not become dependent on him, but the Lord, and I can see his point.

Basically anyone who has a relationship with Christ, and has seen him, is fit for the work. My friend has been in his presence twice or so, and seen him once, just recently. He talked to me when I was 12, in a bright glow, then when I was in my 40s, he came to me 3 times in one night, in vision, with these words, By my authority, I give you power in the Priesthood; but it was not until more recently, that I realized what it was all about; thinking, I already had it. And He came to me in word, and set me free from my abusive X and had my Baptism of Fire around 30 years ago.

I have decided on my friend for the Baptism, but was thinking, and asking about Christ, John the Beloved or one of my family line too, one of the 3 Nephites to etc.

[..]. I enjoy the groups, I like the fellowship there and the sharing of ideas, although many seem like they are aware, but not Spiritually connected like myself and few others I know.

Basically if one had the Aaronic PH before 2013, you are good, and you can Baptize with that, being sustained by 7 women in our movements to do it beyond you family. DS talks about, in Scripture, that Gift of the Holy Ghost is a more recent ordinance; in the Book of Mormon, they seemed to just Baptize, and the Holy Ghost came then or in time. It was related during Joseph's time, that, only someone who had seen or heard Christ voice, had the power and authority to actually bestow the Holy Ghost; if that includes the right to give the Gift of the Holy Ghost, then no wonder the Church is a mess, and everyone is running around, thinking they have it, when they don't. Everything really must come from God or Christ, and you do not perform anything, unless you have his ok; but then that has always been the rule,

I was thinking I did not need baptized, but then finally 6 months or more ago, the Lord told me, to do it on my next Birthday, which is interestingly, a full moon, and the even of the next Jewish Passover; have to think there is some significance to that date or the Lord just wants to see if I will obey and follow through; another test of faith if you will.

I hope I may have been of some help, in some small way. Feel free to ask more, maybe some on this site, will peek in and laden more too,

Rather off topic, but...
A side note, just got my results back for a First Nation, Native American DNA Test, did not pick up on all of the tribes I knew where there, but did pick up on the most recent ones, from my fathers side mostly. 12% Cherokee and 2 % Comanche. Always knew since a kid, I was part Cherokee, this just proves it.

David.

How Have Actual Relationship God Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 2

David, thanks so much your text it really helped. What I desire is a personal relationship with the Savior. I know kind of what that entails from reading what people that have seen him have experienced. I know He will teach me, ask you what gift I would like to receive (I will ask for the gift of charity) and then give me a mission that will incorporate the gift I receive.

I trust Him. I will wait patiently until this occurs, but am still actively seeking it. I know I will happen when The time is right for me

I am not so much looking for a fellowship as I am those who personally know the Savior. I guess maybe a fellowship of those that actually have a testimony and personal witness that He lives.

Although I haven't seen Him myself, these are kinds of people I keep coming across and gravitating to?They seem to be the kind of person I am and with the same desires. I understand them and learn from them. I guess I want to move from doing good to actually "Becoming" good, becoming like my Savior. Seeing Him as He is and becoming pure as He is pure. I think knowing him will change me in a way that nothing else can. The BOok of Mormon testifies of this in Lehis dream of the tree of life. Those that come to the tree (Christ), receive the fruit of charity, and charity never fails.

David I hope we can continue to talk I have lots of questions. I'm not sure if this is the forum for it or not. I'm certainly not afraid to speak my heart publicly, I am past worrying about ridicule and not fitting the mold. I just want to know my savior and be filled with Real love… Charity, because it never fails.

Thanks again.