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Urim Thummim - Mormon Doctrine Studies - Posted: 19th Apr, 2014 - 12:38pm
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Part 31: Urim & ThummimCard
Urim & Thummim
Urim & Thummim
See if you can guess what is being attacked here and your answer for it.
Note: If this is your first time seeing this type of Thread then please check the first part in this series to understand what we are doing here: Source 6
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Thummim and Urim
| QUOTE (JB @ 2-Sep 08, 10:25 PM) |
| Urim & Thummim See if you can guess what is being attacked here and your answer for it. |
It seems they are attacking Joseph's translation of the Book of Mormon. It is referring to his early treasure divining years of using a hat and seer stones. Fast forward to after his marriage to Emma. Her father reported stopping by to visit one day to find Joseph sitting at a table with a hat over his face uttering Biblical phrases. On the table was a square object concealed by a cloth (presumably the gold plates). Emma was sitting behind a curtain, hidden from Joseph, writing down the words. Emma's father reported seeing two stones in the hat when Joseph removed his hat from his face. He said they were similar to the stones Joseph had used in divining the location of the "buried Spanish treasure." He basically inferred that Joseph was "up to his old magic tricks" again.
In the beginning Emma acted as Joseph's scribe during his translation of the Book of Mormon. They worked in a room separated by a curtain.
As for Joseph's "treasure divining," refer to Joseph Smith History 1:56
| QUOTE |
| 56 In the year 1823 my father's family met with a great affliction by the death of my eldest brother, Alvin. In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, to dig for the silver mine, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger. |
The reference on the card referencing taking paper and crayon to design your own card relates to Joseph Smith History 1:62-65
| QUOTE |
| 62 By this timely aid was I enabled to reach the place of my destination in Pennsylvania; and immediately after my arrival there I commenced copying the characters off the plates. I copied a considerable number of them, and by means of the aUrim and Thummim I translated some of them, which I did between the time I arrived at the house of my wife's father, in the month of December, and the February following. 63 Sometime in this month of February, the aforementioned Mr. Martin Harris came to our place, got the characters which I had drawn off the plates, and started with them to the city of New York. For what took place relative to him and the characters, I refer to his own account of the circumstances, as he related them to me after his return, which was as follows: 64 "I went to the city of New York, and presented the characters which had been translated, with the translation thereof, to Professor Charles Anthon, a gentleman celebrated for his literary attainments. Professor Anthon stated that the translation was correct, more so than any he had before seen translated from the Egyptian. I then showed him those which were not yet translated, and he said that they were Egyptian, Chaldaic, Assyriac, and Arabic; and he said they were true characters. He gave me a certificate, certifying to the people of Palmyra that they were true characters, and that the translation of such of them as had been translated was also correct. I took the certificate and put it into my pocket, and was just leaving the house, when Mr. Anthon called me back, and asked me how the young man found out that there were gold plates in the place where he found them. I answered that an angel of God had revealed it unto him. 65 "He then said to me, "Let me see that certificate." I accordingly took it out of my pocket and gave it to him, when he took it and tore it to pieces, saying that there was no such thing now as ministering of aangels, and that if I would bring the plates to him he would translate them. I informed him that part of the plates were bsealed, and that I was forbidden to bring them. He replied, "I cannot read a sealed book." I left him and went to Dr. Mitchell, who sanctioned what Professor Anthon had said respecting both the characters and the translation." |
Urim & Thummim Studies Doctrine Mormon
Good take Alskann. Somethings are hard to swallow when you consider how secular religion tells us it all happens in a certain way and God does not change, but which of us understands God? Are we even capable of such a feat. This reminds me of the Chrystal Skulls... might be something more there - we have a Thread on it I think.
Urim & Thummim
I am curious to your answer Zelph--do you think they got BACK there via Moroni?
The reason I ask is that I remember hearing that the plates and the U&T were taken back by the angel Moroni after he was done translating.
Urim & Thummim
That's correct AlaskanLDS and I think they are kept along with The Sword of Laban and the Golden plates in the Hill Cumorah.
An Interesting reading:
QUOTE Brigham Young, on June 17, 1877, related the following: "I lived right in the country where the plates were found from which the Book of Mormon was translated, and I know a great many things pertaining to that country. I believe I will take the liberty to tell you of another circumstance that will be as marvelous as anything can be. This is an incident in the life of Oliver Cowdery, that he did not take the liberty of telling such things in meeting as I take.
"I tell these things to you, and I have a motive for doing so. I want to carry them to the ears of my brethren and sisters, and to the children also, that they may grow to an understanding of some things that seem to be entirely hidden from the human family. Oliver Cowdery went with the Prophet Joseph when he deposited these plates. Joseph did not translate all of the plates; there was a portion of them sealed, which you can learn from the Book of Doctrine and Covenants. When Joseph got the plates, the angel instructed him to carry them back to the Hill Cumorah, which he did.
"Oliver says that when Joseph and Oliver went there, the hill opened, and they walked into a cave, in which there was a large and spacious room. He says he did not think, at the time, whether they had the light of the sun or artificial light, but that it was just as light as day. They laid the plates on a table; it was a large table that stood in the room. Under this table there was a pile of plates as much as two feet high, and there were altogether in this room more plates than probably many wagon loads; they were piled up in corners and along the walls.
"The first time they went there the SWORD OF LABAN hung upon the wall; but when they went again it had been taken down and laid upon the table across the gold plates; it was unsheathed, and on it was written these words: 'This sword will never be sheathed again until the kingdoms of this world become the kingdom of our God and his Christ." I tell you this is coming not only from Oliver Cowdery, but others who were familiar with it, and who understood it... I take the liberty of referring to those things so they will not be forgotten and lost." (19 Journal of Discourses 38)
Urim & Thummim Mormon Doctrine Studies
I had read that before and just marvel of the information that is recorded on them! I cannot wish I had them because I don't understand everything we already have..but I would love to sit in "that library" for awhile!
TOPIC: Urim & Thummim