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Are All Men Really Equal?

Someone said in another part of this site that all men are equal. Are they really? In what way can you show me proof that all men are equal when centuries of history has proven otherwise?

Equal Men Are

And where are your centuries of proof that have proven men are not equal? And which men are better than others? (as if I don't know your answer to that) Please, enlighten us with your evidence, so that we may discuss it. After all, you should need nearly three posts or more with centuries of evidence. I know a bit of history myself, so be careful what you claim as evidence. Evidence against the barbaric past of white Europe is vast.

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I would be interested to know what you are referring to when you say "centuries of history has proven otherwise." because I agree that history has shown people can treat other people as though they are lesser than them but that isn't proof that the people treated as such actually were.

For instance, I believe the quote you're referring to was to do with the American constitution and how it starts "all men are created equal." But of course the founding fathers of America did not include their slaves in this, the Native American population or women because what they actually meant was that "all white men of European descent are created equal" and this was understood.

Today, thankfully, the terminology is taken to mean all people of all races and all genders because society has moved on and realises that it is impossible to think someone is less than you based on such criteria. Women are not children to be protected, black people are not intellectually inferior. The phrase, as it is is understood today, is perhaps better stated as: "all human beings, because of their humanity, are created equal."

So, getting back to my initial thought: societies of all types have created the belief that certain groups within them are inferior. From the Romans who enslaved entire Celtic populations because they perceived anyone of non-Roman citizenship to be inferior to the European Nobles who viewed the serfs working on their lands to be of poor stock. And then on to India were an entire Caste system existed and still exists that structures its people based on the level of material wealth they are born in to. I believe the way it works is based on the hindu belief of reincarnation. If a person is born into a poor family they have committed too much sin in their previous life and are therefore being punished by poverty. Hence why the poor in India are known as the "untouchables" because why would you touch people so spiritually impure?

Today, the western economic system pretty much does they same thing. If you're born into a wealthy or a poor background you tend to stay in a wealthy or a poor background. Poorer people have less access to the aspects of life that keep the wealthy rich and so the cycle continues. So this system does indeed create inequality BUT on a philosophical level it is understood that this does not mean anyone is unequal on a human level.

Edited: Dougiep on 18th Dec, 2007 - 5:08pm

Equal Men Are

Slavery - that is the back bone of everything. Slavery has always been the case of the powerful over the weak. It has been this way from the beginning of time, even in the Bible. All you have to do is look at which races were in slavery and which ones were the masters and you will get the picture.

Equal Men Are

No, I'm afraid the picture will have to be explained to me. Can you expand on your ideas please and explain what evidence you have used to come to this conclusion?

Are All Men Really Equal?

Before digging your self in to deep I will place this question to you can you name one race that at some point was not enslaved to another?

Example:

1530-1780

African corsairs from the Barbary Coast in North Africa would raid ships in the Atlantic and Mediterranean Ocean, along with seaside villages to capture Men, women and children from France England and Spain. In fact if you compare the numbers at their peak they likely enslaved more then the Europeans did later when they started taking African slaves.

During this time period any one who lived in a sea side village took the risk of enslavement.

Are Men Equal

For me to answer this I will need you to define 'equal'. Certainly we are not all physically equal. Mentally we are all different as well. If you are talking about some kind of spiritual term then we seem to be different there too given all the belief systems in the world. If you are saying the worth of human life then we are all valuable. I do actually see what you are hinting at with slavery and I, as a free man, living in a society now where such things as slavery are unheard of I cannot comprehend it. Yet we read many instances of 'acceptable' slavery among nations which seem to think that some human life was not 'equal'. Anyway, I have gone on a bit. Please define it for me.

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Ahhh...slavery or as you put it "the ability of the ones with power to force it on those that have no power". Power and social structure are not things with which we are born with... As the Preamble says...all men are "created" equally. It is the deeds of those with power that may tip the balance after birth as you have eluded to.

History is littered with fantastic stories of those that were born under the thumbs of powerful overlords rising up to overthrow them...time and time again. We need to look no further than US for a more recent picture (only a couple of hundred years). Who would have thought that a small nation of wilderness, unkempt, heathens could tell the King of England that his fiefdom was no more? The US was owned by the powerful and had little military to back up its words, but did so.

We could go back to the fall of the highly sophisticated Roman Empire that fell to a band of gypsies. The same ones that were forced to bow at one time to the emperor of Rome. Inquisition after inquisition, forcing their power on the world, but where is Rome now? The powerless got their revenge and the ones in power...and at the time thought to be better...fell.

The Persian empire falls...to who?

The Kahn for a period of time rule the world...

Ireland regains its freedom and forms a republic...

France once rules a majority of the world...where are we now?

At one point, egyptian culture was near the top...shouldn't it be today?

Spain at one time was the world's #1 power...where did that go? Shouldn't the Spanish still rule? Why aren't we all speaking spanish?

If the powerful are always destine to stay powerful, why all this change? Why is the world watching China slowly become the #1 country in the world? Throughout history it says that everyone can have their day... White anglo-saxons have had their day...this too will change and is changing before your eyes. This could not happen if we were not created equally...it is what happens after we are created where man shows his hand. Either that...or someone decided to start creating Chinese a bit better in recent decades...