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Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... - Page 17

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But what petty objections from the women!

I know.  I posted a link to a Christian site earlier in this thread.  It addresses some of those issues.  If I covet my own wife, and my wife covets me, then I don't think either of us is headed towards the Celestial Kingdom.

As for the men -

You may not realize it, but it really frightens us.  I have an extremely difficult time satisfying my own wife's emotional and spiritual needs and wants.  To imagine doubling or tripling that!  I am not talking about anything petty or physical here.  I worry about her anxiety.  I am concerned about her health.  I worry about my inadequacies in regards to her.

At the same time....
I work in a manufacturing facility, where we build automatic transmissions.  It is very noisy.  I make gears.  We have a small room out in the middle of the plant floor, where we have some precision measuring equipment, so it has constant heating and a/c to keep the temperature right at 72 degrees.  Because of this, there is also constant sound in the room.

Sometimes, at lunch or break time, I will go in this room and sit.  Sometimes I sleep.  Othertimes, I just ponder, practice breathing exercises, etc.

One day, I was thinking about the last days.  I believe that there will be cities of refuge popping up around the Rocky Mountains.  For some reason, I feel particularly drawn towards the Manti / Ephraim Utah area.  So, I was just pondering what it might be like with the city of refuge that I feel will be built there.  While thinking, I remembered that most of the people (not Prophets) who have had dreams and visions about these cities of refuge have seen almost only women and children fleeing to these cities.

So, I was kind of daydreaming, on the edge of sleep.  I thought of what it would be like if my family were there.  I thought about standing "guard" at the south entrance to the valley, helping people to enter, find a home, etc.  Suddenly, my daydream took a strange turn.  Such a strange turn the I opened up my eyes and sat up straight, and was almost frightened at the intensity of the ideas and emotions.

What I suddenly felt was that there would be families who would set up areas where they would build "tent cities" and those families would get very large.  As women and children would trickle into the valley, the Priesthood members would greet them, guide them to families who could help them, and then minister to their needs, especially the spiritual needs.  I could almost see it in my mind's eye, how we would help them carry their children into our homes, welcome them as sisters.

As it went on, I thought of how we, the Priesthood, would welcome them, explaining that they were free to join our families, as sisters/daughters/aunts, etc., not as wives.  At the same time, I felt that I was accepting the responsibility of blessing their children, taking them in as my own, and providing for them.

There was more, but this has really stuck with me.  The emotions are as strong now as they were when I experienced this several months ago.  It wasn't a vision or a dream, it just felt like my thoughts were being drawn towards a specific direction.  Eventually, I did think about plural marriage in regards to this, but it was far different than anything I had ever considered before.  It was that my wife, along with some other women, came up to me and told me who they wanted to have join us in our marriage.  I basically only had 'veto' power in the conversation.

It was a very interesting, powerful experience.

NightHawk

Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural

Nighthawk said:

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Eventually, I did think about plural marriage in regards to this, but it was far different than anything I had ever considered before.  It was that my wife, along with some other women, came up to me and told me who they wanted to have join us in our marriage.  I basically only had 'veto' power in the conversation.

"And in that day seven women shall lay hold of one man...."

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So, I was kind of daydreaming, on the edge of sleep.

This is very interesting to hear -- I've read that this is the place where the mind often "does it's best thinking" or is led to visions... that "hinterland" between waking and sleep where the mind is not super-controlled by inhibitions, nor completely lost in the subconscious.  If we could direct that specific time/state of consciousness better, we could solve complex problems, see the future, etc.  But that's a whole 'nother topic.

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You may not realize it, but it really frightens us.  I have an extremely difficult time satisfying my own wife's emotional and spiritual needs and wants.  To imagine doubling or tripling that!  I am not talking about anything petty or physical here.  I worry about her anxiety.  I am concerned about her health.  I worry about my inadequacies in regards to her.

You dear man.  I hope she knows of and appreciates your great concern for her!

I think I've mentioned before of people that I know who are heading for the wilderness now, or who are already there.  And who are tentatively seeking other "like-minded" people to join them and share the working of the land and the maintaining of it -- and the guarding of it, when it comes to that.  These are not necessarily LDS, and not even necessarily Christians, but people concerned with  survival when the infrastructure fails.  I've been approached, but I don't feel at this time that I have enough to contribute, as far as experience goes, and I couldn't support myself and my daughter out in the boonies (jobs are too far away).  But, as you say, there will be families out there in the last days, already settled in.  

How close are we to this?  How much worse does the world need to get?  "...lack of men due to wars."  I hope I'm prepared spiritually, if not temporally with food etc, when it all "goes south."


IMO
Roz

Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... Studies Doctrine Mormon

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I really do believe that it is a necessary law in order to enter the Celestial Kingdom.  This is based on teachings by Joseph F. Smith, in particular. Â

If this is true, then Heavenly Father will make a way because I do not believe he will punish us for faithfully following his chosen prophets.  I do not believe he wants us to live this law currently against the teachings of our prophet.  Someday, if we are to live this law again, I believe we will be instructed to do so through our Church leaders, whether that be public or private.

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I have also read Mosiah Hancock's history, wherein he was given a vision of the pre-mortal existence, and gained some excellent insights into some of the reasons for plural marriage.

Who was Mosiah Hancock?  I know he wasn't a prophet so any revelation he received was not intended as direction for the Church as a whole.  We need to be careful regarding whose revelations we are accepting as from Heavenly Father and more specifically as pertaining to how they should apply to us and our lives.  Since, I don't know who Mosiah Hancock was or what his revelation was I cannot pass judgement regarding applicability to my life now or what may be required of me in the future.

Page 17 Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural

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Speculation and seeking out the realities of what anti-Mormons and anti-polygamists spout are not part of those interests

I assume by this comment that you have not study the subject at all. This is not an anti-mormon speculation, if not just check familysearch.org and search for the Prophet Joseph Smith's wives and you will see he was not only sealed to already married women but some of them after Smith's death were sealed to Brigham Young also so it's not an speculation from anti-mormon sources but a fact...one of Smith's wives even gave a talk in BYU and talked openly about it.....(its in BYU records).

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Yep.  Just like the lies that Joseph Smith told, when he first started the practice.  Just like the lie that Nephi lived while getting the brass plates.

Plenty examples like this in the Old Testament and nobody makes a fuss about it....

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I don't blame President Woodruff.  I blame the saints who rejected the principle, and begged the Lord and His servants to halt the practice.  If the saints had had the faith to ask the Lord, I am sure He would have fought their battles for them.

I wish I can have the boldness you have in making this statement....it's so easy to say it but we were not on our pioneer's shoes....it's easy to say this sitting down on a couch and just researching about it, real life was different at the time and if we as weak people like we are cannot even handle the principle of love one another or the word of wisdom...do you think we at that time be between the ones who thought about praying God to continue the practise? heck no!!!!! we would be between the ones who beg the Lord to stop it! no doubt about it!.

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As I said before, I think that when people practice it, it will be through direct, personal revelation to those who are approaching Zion.  The rest of us who are languishing in Babylon will not even notice.

It will come only through revelation to the Prophet and then He will manifest this revelation to those involved...not the other way around.

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So I agree with you, Nighthawk.  Even if the U.S. government does fall (and I believe fed.empire.gov is bound to) the Saints are NOT prepared to live that law.

Of course not, we cannot even do our Home and Visiting Teaching :

Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural

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I assume by this comment that you have not study the subject at all. This is not an anti-mormon speculation, if not just check familysearch.org and search for the Prophet Joseph Smith's wives and you will see he was not only sealed to already married women but some of them after Smith's death were sealed to Brigham Young also so it's not an speculation from anti-mormon sources but a fact...one of Smith's wives even gave a talk in BYU and talked openly about it.....(its in BYU records).

It is my understanding that in the early days of the Church people as a matter of course used to have their dead relatives sealed to Joseph Smith and Brigham Young and other great Church leaders not necessarily to their own fathers for example.  Maybe the practice of being sealed to someone other than your husband was done for similar purposes.  I don't remember where I read this, but I know that some later prophet clarified that this wasn't supposed to be done this way, but that people were to be sealed to the family in which they were born not all to Joseph Smith, etc., and so we now seal our ancestors to their ancestors, etc.

Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall...

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It is my understanding that in the early days of the Church people as a matter of course used to have their dead relatives sealed to Joseph Smith and Brigham Young and other great Church leaders not necessarily to their own fathers for example.  Maybe the practice of being sealed to someone other than your husband was done for similar purposes.  I don't remember where I read this, but I know that some later prophet clarified that this wasn't supposed to be done this way, but that people were to be sealed to the family in which they were born not all to Joseph Smith, etc., and so we now seal our ancestors to their ancestors, etc.

Tena, yes I know what you mean...but this goes more deeper than that. I'm trying to look for more deep information about this, if you read this whole thread you will see that there are other issues that goes even far than just 'sealing' . Mary Lightner speech in BYU in 1905:

"Joseph came up the next Sabbath. He said, "Have you had a witness yet?" "No." "Well," said he, "the angel expressly told me you should have." Said I, "I have not had a witness, but I have seen something I have never seen before. I saw an angel and I was frightened almost to death. I did not speak." He studied a while and put his elbows on his knees and his face in his hands. He looked up and said, "How could you have been such a coward?" Said I, "I was weak." "Did you think to say, 'Father, help me?'" "No." "Well, if you had just said that, your mouth would have been opened for that was an angel of the living God. He came to you with more knowledge, intelligence, and light than I have ever dared to reveal." I said, "If that was an angel of light, why did he not speak to me?" "You covered your face and for this reason the angel was insulted." Said I, "Will it ever come again?" He thought a moment and then said, "No, not the same one, but if you are faithful you shall see greater things than that." And then he (Joseph Smith) gave me three signs of what would take place in my own family, although my husband was far away from me at the
time. Every work came true. I went forward and was sealed to him. Brigham Young performed the sealing, and Heber C. Kimball the blessing. I know he (Joseph Smith) had six wives and I have known some of them from childhood
up. I knew he had three children. They told me. I think two are living today but they are not known as his children as they go by other names."
( Lightner, Mary Elizabeth Rollins. 1905. Pp. 2;3 in "Remarks by Sister Mary E. Lightner who was sealed to Joseph Smith in 1842." (Address to Brigham Young University, April 14, 1905), in "Papers, 1865';1914," BYU Special Collections, Vault MSS 363, folder )


You can read more about this in page 2 in this same thread.

The other issues is why he was sealed to sisters who were sealed already with worthy LDS members...what was  the purpose of it?. (read more in page 4 of this thread)

And this from Brigham Young:

"But there was a way in which a woman could leave a man lawfully - when a woman becomes alienated in her feeling and affections from her husband, it is his duty to give her a bill and set her free - it would be fornication for a man to cohabit with his wife after she had thus become alienated from him...Also, there was another way in which a woman could leave a man - if the woman preferred a man higher in authority and he is willing to take her and her husband gives her up. There is no bill of divorce required, in [this] case it is right in the sight of God."
(From the Journal of Discourses)

No need for divorce if a man higher in authority wishes to marry a sister in the Church who is lawfully married? I don't understand this at all.
I still looking for answers Tena,  I would suggest you to read this whole thread, there is a lot of information with sources and all.

Plural Marriage That Day Women Shall... - Page 17

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I still looking for answers Tena,  I would suggest you to read this whole thread, there is a lot of information with sources and all.

LDS, I read all of this thread before I made my first post to it. .  This is a complex issue and many questions have been raised.  I was just trying to perhaps offer a thought that might answer some of them.  I don't have answers to all of them (if I even have an answer for any of them :-/ ) .  

I am just saying that some of this behavior might be explained by a misunderstanding by the Saints (including prophets) that was clarified later by the Lord.

Plural Marriage That Day Women Shall... Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 17

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I am just saying that some of this behavior might be explained by a misunderstanding by the Saints (including prophets) that was clarified later by the Lord.

I guess some believe that the Lord has yet to clarify it?