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Related Information to Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall...Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... - Page 39 of 79
Interesting point of view. I cannot remember - Page 39 - Mormon Doctrine Studies - Posted: 6th Oct, 2004 - 1:42am
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Mormon Doctrine on Plural Marriage - This Thread goes deep into all the angles of Mormon Polygamy, the requirement of Celestial Marriage which once encompassed Plural Marriage and the current standing of it with the modern Church. Also deeply analyzed is Joseph Smith's secret practise of it that latter lead to his death. Controversial Mormon Issue. Related Information to Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall...
Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... - Page 39
Here is a very interesting news item concerning this subject:
https://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/colum...03-turley_x.htm
| QUOTE |
| Tom Green is an American polygamist. This month, he will appeal his conviction in Utah for that offense to the United States Supreme Court, in a case that could redefine the limits of marriage, privacy and religious freedom. . . . . Individuals have a recognized constitutional right to engage in any form of consensual sexual relationship with any number of partners. Thus, a person can live with multiple partners and even sire children from different partners so long as they do not marry. However, when that same person accepts a legal commitment for those partners "as a spouse," we jail them. . . . . Indeed, studies have found polygamy present in 78% of the world's cultures, including some Native American tribes. (While most are polygynists - with one man and multiple women - there are polyandrists in Nepal and Tibet in which one woman has multiple male spouses.) As many as 50,000 polygamists live in the United States. Given this history and the long religious traditions, it cannot be seriously denied that polygamy is a legitimate religious belief. Since polygamy is a criminal offense, polygamists do not seek marriage licenses. However, even living as married can send you to prison. Prosecutors have asked courts to declare a person as married under common law and then convicted them of polygamy. . . . . I personally detest polygamy. Yet if we yield to our impulse and single out one hated minority, the First Amendment becomes little more than hype and we become little more than hypocrites. For my part, I would rather have a neighbor with different spouses than a country with different standards for its citizens. |
This has always been my position. I firmly believe that the laws against plural marriage are unjust, unconstitutional, and wrong. Since I do believe that the principle of plural marriage is true and eternal, I think that the Tom Green case might be the one that cracks the legal stranglehold on the practice of religion.
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Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural
Actually, I am surprised that this argument has not been brought forward before. Based on current 'trends' in the Church I really do not see a re-introduction of Plural Marriage anytime soon, even if it were made legal, but that is just my limited perspective.
Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... Studies Doctrine Mormon
When I first heard about the Tom Green case, I wondered if it was/is a test case to force the issue before the Supreme Court. It certainly wasn't the Utah prosecutor, nor the Church that pressed the case. I firmly believe that this is the Lord's way to press the case.
Page 39 Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural
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| I firmly believe that this is the Lord's way to press the case. |
Wow, that is a very strong opinion. You feel the Lord is 'anxious' for plural marriage to be restored? Are His people ready to live this law again? I ask that, because it seems that they were not ready the first time.
Second, even if the Church were to restore this (Plural Marriage among the living), consider that only selected Brothers will be 'chosen' to live this way. Consider that if the Church did not acknowledge the legality of plural marriage (even if it were made legal in the USA) and still saw only one woman and one man marriages while condemning all others, how would you take that? You may say they would need to justify that, but then it might be that we are not ready?
| Offtopic but, Consider this... if the US were to say that plural, gay and other marriages are okay then do you think the Church would really reinstitute it again knowing that there would still be many other countries that do not allow this form of marriage? The other point is that with the way the world is now (terrorism, etc.) having a US citizen in multiple contracts (marriage) with individuals who are not US Citizens would seem hard to regulate / control which of course is what the government wants to do. Most of these observations can be had based on the current situation in South Africa where plural marriage is legal (I believe Tena brought that up). |
Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural
I wouldn't say that the Lord is "anxious" for the law to change, any more than He is "anxious" for the Gospel to go into Iran.
However, He does have a plan, and He does answer prayers. I know for certain that there are a lot of people praying desperately to be able to live this principle without persecution.
I think that what will happen is that the Church will allow plural marriage, as there are a lot of places in the world where polygamy is not only legal, but very common. (Actually, 75-78% of the cultures in the world presently practice polygyny.) At the moment, I understand that when a man who has more than one wife joins the Church, he is required to 'put away' one of them.
I believe that the Lord DOES require this principle of those who would truly be His people. Therefore, if the Church refuses to obey His will, then something will have to happen to get our attention, right? Something like a huge split in the Church?
Are the people ready to live the law? Probably not. But then I believe that only a small percentage of us will be ready for His Kingdom. The rest of us had better be ready to get ready, in a big hurry.
We know of two Celestial Laws. Plural marriage and full consecration (the United Order). The Lord has let us live a Terrestial Law for the last 124 years. Maybe this is the beginning of the great sifting.
Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall...
| QUOTE |
| At the moment, I understand that when a man who has more than one wife joins the Church, he is required to 'put away' one of them. |
Put away one of them or put away all of them and remain with one?
| QUOTE |
| I believe that the Lord DOES require this principle of those who would truly be His people. |
Well I believe He requires that we accept the principle but I am not sure if He expects it as a requirement at least not in this life. Had it been a requirement then I believe the percentage of Brethren that lived this law during the time it was legal would have been much higher.
| QUOTE |
| Therefore, if the Church refuses to obey His will, then something will have to happen to get our attention, right? Something like a huge split in the Church? |
When you say if the Church refuses do you mean the general membership or the First Presidency and the Twelve? Do you think that this will just be announced or will it be placed for sustaining vote?
I was just wondering... does the Church do anything at all to reverse the law as it is now so that Plural Marriage can become legal - even if it is behind the scenes?
Plural Marriage That Day Women Shall... - Page 39
| QUOTE |
| Put away one of them or put away all of them and remain with one? |
Put away all but one. Keep supporting the children and the wife or wives, but not be part of the families, or at least only minimally.
| QUOTE |
| Well I believe He requires that we accept the principle but I am not sure if He expects it as a requirement at least not in this life. |
I believe that it is an absolute requirement. At least 75% of the members of the Church in the early days refused to live the principle. Brigham Young continually urged them to live it, but they refused. I have heard the number to be closer to 90%.
| QUOTE |
| When you say if the Church refuses do you mean the general membership or the First Presidency and the Twelve? Do you think that this will just be announced or will it be placed for sustaining vote? |
Both refuse. I truly believe that the Church will be completely set in order. Most of the indications I have seen imply that Joseph Smith will return, as a resurrected being, to set the Church in order. The two Celestial Laws will be reinstituted. Remember that this is supposed to be the Dispensation of the FULNESS of Times. Things are supposed to be restored, not taken away. Yet both of the Celestial Laws were taken away, as the majority of the people rejected them.
How can we hope to be part of the Millenial Kingdom, if we resist the laws He has already given us? We have successfully persecuted those who believe in this Celestial principle for almost 100 years. I think it is almost exactly 100 years since the last officially recognized plural marriage was solemnized. Since that time, we have persecuted Apostles out of their offices, driven members of the Church underground, out of our society, out of their families' lives, for practicing their religion to the best of their ability.
I do NOT believe that the Church is involved, in any way, with the Tom Green case. There are an awful lot of members who fully support the persecution, and are thrilled that Mr. Green is in prison, separated from his loving wives and children.
I am not a fan of Mr. Green's. I am less of a fan of the persecution.
Sorry about the rant. I am getting too worked up over this subject.
Plural Marriage That Day Women Shall... Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 39
Interesting point of view. I cannot remember if we discussed this or not, but what time line are you giving for these events? Is this return of Joseph going to be before the Savior comes? So based on what you said, you feel that there are Brethren who even now will set to turn aside from Plural marriage? Have you already placed names to this? I guess that will be based on your timeline. Outside of this topic, do you sympathize with the Pluralist groups? You know that won't do too well in a Recommend interview 
.
TOPIC: Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall...