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Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... - Page 61

Good point,
The issue that I would see, is that Islam was first spread by the Sword, initially "converting" millions to the cause. Islam in its Current form typically is not a voluntary religion (outside of the West) as those who are born into it are forcibly(either by threat of death or by cultural restrictions on other religions) required to live by its precepts. Women are forced to live in less then equal conditions where they are often treated as slaves. And Men believe in strictly islamic societies that women are chattel.

In a completely voluntary Church,with the membership we have now, could the Church really have grown, practicing polygamy? Or would we now be the size of the fundamentalist Church never leaving the Rocky Mountains, teaching the doctrine to ourselves and our Children, but never giving the Gospel to the World?

Oh, and I was reading in the Gospel Library, Gospel Topics on the Church Web site(I know it is not necessarily doctrine, but I thought it was interesting):

So, even if the United States allowed for Polygamy, would the Church really start practicing it. I think this is one of those things that we will not see happening in our lifetimes.

Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural

My reference to Islam was only a basic example, but probably yes, it would be small right now if Plural Marriage were still active. Really, it is small without the Doctrine and when you consider those who even are aware of the true measure of Celestial Marriage then the number might be less than the fundamentalist themselves.

I think the break down occurred with the US Constitution being interpreted wrongfully or in other words, through freedom of religion was not allowed (but I will leave that for the appropriate Thread).

That reference to countries that allow Plural Marriage was Discussed somewhere in this Thread as South Africa has this active. I think there was man who was asked to leave current wives and children for the sake of the Church - very difficult decision. If I remember correctly the Church started to not teach the Gospel among certain tribes that practiced this for that reason.

Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall... Studies Doctrine Mormon

Elder Holland gives a very interesting reply with regards to Plural Marriage, the Church position and his personal views:

https://www.pbs.org/mormons/interviews/holland.html

Page 61 Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural

I believe personally in the principle of plural marriage and I believe it will be required of all who wish to learn, experience, test etc. in the process we call progression. However I think that this is one of the most misinterpreted scriptures when trying to reference the law of plural marriage is this scripture given.

I so not profess to be an expert but I believe that the reference to the 7 wives married to the groom is referencing the 7 Churches who marry or relate themselves to Christ as a Christian Church taking his name upon them (the Church) but yet they would eat of their own bread. In other words although they would call themselves Christ's church this church would not eat of the doctrine of Christ, they would take credit for their own and they would do things in their own manner but would include his name so that they would not be reproached or found guilty of their false practice. You see many churches even now calling themselves or their church Christ's church or ministers of Christ however they minister for money, selling blessings for money etc.

In short, I think this is what that scripture is talking about. However there are plenty of scriptures that reference plural marriage or the everlasting covenant, and it is definitely an eternal "Principle". We confuse the fact that a "Principle" and a "Law" are two separate things. If you can understand the principle than you should be able to have all of these questions below answered:

The Laws:
Why plural marriage?
Why sealing to more than one wife?
Why men being sealed to men?
etc. etc. etc.

We play this off way to much saying that the "brotheren" did not fully understand these things and so they made a lot of mistakes. Yes, and No. Many did these things without the authority of God but there are many LAWS that were being practiced unto this eternal "Principle". So we apologize for the things WE don't understand.

The "Principle" of plural marriage must be understood before you can practice the "Law(s)".

So what is the principle? This is what each of you and I need to not only understand in words but it must become a testimony within us. I will explain what I know about it and keep it simple because much of it is sacred to me and of my understanding. To explain My understanding I will give you reference to the story of Heber C. Kimble and his wife Vilate. What was the purpose of their trial that the Lord commanded Joseph to test them in? Was it for both to learn or for Vilate only? If it was Heber who was also to learn, what was he to learn?

Ask these questions and put yourself in the position of Heber. I have heard the all too well know expression that "Well I am married and I can only handle the one I have." What a selfish thought. WHO GAVE YOU OWNERSHIP OF YOUR WIFE? Get my point? Why we miss the point of this principle is that it is SOOOO much more important than ownership. In fact to say it more appropriately it has nothing to do with ownership. It has everything to do with why we go into the temple in the first place. Notice how everything we do in the temple has to do with becoming one? Not just one as husband and wife and family, but as God's Family. Reflect on that for a moment. If we cannot separate ourselves from this whole "MINE" psychology, we will never graduate to the next step. This is what we understood as an infant. Everything was, "Mine". My life, my toy, my food, my mom, my blanket etc.

We are given the family unit to learn on a personal everyday level THIS PRINCIPLE of the everlasting covenant. Covenant with whom? Go back to the reflection of the temple. Yes with God, but whom else? Prayer circle? think hard.

This is the Principle when you can understand it. Once you can really understand it, then you can practice the LAWS that surround it. Plural Marriage, Sealing's etc. Yes sealing's are different. Goes more with genealogy or the Patriarchal Order and then leads you to the law of sealing men to men.

I will stop there. Not trying to pretend to have a higher knowledge than anyone in here. This is just food for thought. The rest of the stories of who said what, said what to whom etc. etc. does not really matter unless you like history which I do.

Take what you want, leave the rest behind or leave it all behind. Again not trying to be an authority here, I just feel that I have gained a lot of understanding on this subject in the last 10 years of study.

Shall Women Day That Marriage Plural

Before I reply, do you have any source material concerning the Isaiah scripture quoted other than your own belief of its interpretation?

Plural Marriage: In That Day Seven Women Shall...

Actually JB I descent. I was wrong on the scripture. I ws thinking of the refrences made within revelations and the seven churches. I stand corrected on the scripture as I beleive it does reference to plural marriage.

I stand by my points on the principles however. THose are my feelings and the results in part of my studies.

Thanks for answering and questioning my reference. I admit my fault.

Plural Marriage That Day Women Shall... - Page 61

I understand your feelings on the Topic, if you read the entire Thread you will know our feelings on the subject so there will be no need to repeat it again.

However, I will touch on something you keep emphasizing: commandments, policies and principles are all different. Principles are based on eternal unchanging actions such as: Love, Faith, Obedience, etc. Commandments / Covenants are based on actions to be executed at certain times: Baptism, Marriage, etc.

In other words Plural Marriage would fall under commandments / covenants because they are had at certain times, just as with Baptism. Yes, we all must be Baptized, but only at a certain time and after a certain qualification, but principles are not like that - you do them anywhere, anytime and always, there are no bounds, limits or time lines with Principles. I believe this Topic is more intensely Discussed elsewhere, please do a Search if you wish to Discuss it more as we are mainly about Plural Marriage here.

I do have a question for you based on what you wrote:

In what way do you currently 'live' Plural Marriage?

Plural Marriage That Day Women Shall... Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 61

I didn't say I lived plural marriage. I don't live it but I definitely try to live with the principle in mind in the way I treat my wife, my children and others. I am not perfect of course but I do my best to treat them respectfully and with love.

If me answer sounded like I was saying that I lived plural marriage, I am sorry for the misunderstanding.