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Lucifer Tells the Truth... - Page 2

From a certain point of vantage I was permitted to view this earth and what was going on here. There was no limitation of my vision and I was astounded at this. I saw my wife and children at home. I saw President Heber J. Grant at the head of the Great Church and Kingdom of God and felt the divine power that radiates from God giving it light and truth and guiding its destiny. I beheld this nation founded as it is on correct principles and designed to endure, but beset by evil and sinister forces that seek to lead men to thwart the purposes of God. I saw towns and cities; the sins and wickedness of men and women. I saw vessels sailing the oceans and scanned the battle-scarred fields of France and Belgium. In a word, I beheld the whole world as if it were but a panorama passing before my eyes.

Then there came to me the unmistakable impression that this earth and scenes and persons upon it are open to the vision of the spirits only when special permission is given or when they are assigned to special service here. This is particularly true of the righteous who are busily engaged in two fields of activity at the same time.

The wicked and unrepentant have still, like the rest, their free agency, and applying themselves to no useful or wholesome undertaking, seek pleasure about their old haunts and exalt in the sin and wickedness of degenerated humanity. To this extent they are still the tools of Satan. It is these idle, mischievous and deceptive spirits who appear as miserable counterfeits at spiritualist seances, table dancing and ouija board operation. The noble and great ones do not respond to the call of the mediums and to every curious group of meddlesome inquirers. They would not do it in the world of mortality, certainly they would not do it in their increased state of knowledge in the world of immortality. These wicked and unrepentant spirits are [tools] of Satan and his host, operating through willing mediums in the flesh. These three forces constitute an unholy trinity upon the earth and are responsible for all the sin, wickedness, distress and misery among men and nations.

I moved forward feasting my eyes upon the beauty of everything about me and glorying in the indescribable peace and happiness that abounded in everybody and through everything. The further I went, the more glorious things appeared. While standing at a certain vantage point, I beheld a short distance away a wonderful beautiful temple, capped with golden domes, from which emerged a small group of men dressed in white robes who paused for a brief conversation. They were the first I had seen thus clad. The million that I had previously seen were in uniforms. In this little group of holy men, my eyes centered upon one more splendid and holy than the rest. While I thus gazed, President Joseph F. Smith parted from the others and came to my side. "Do you know him?" he inquired. I quietly answered, "Yes, I know him. My eyes behold my Lord and Savior." "It is true," said President Smith. And, oh, how my soul thrilled with rapture, and unspeakable joy filled my heart!

President Smith informed me that I had been given permission to return and complete the mission upon the earth which the Lord had appointed to me to fulfill, and then with his hand upon my shoulder, uttered these memorable and significant words, "Brother Heber, you have a great work to do. Go forward with a prayerful heart and thou shall be blessed in your ministry. From this time on, never doubt that God lives, that Jesus Christ is the Son, the Savior of the World, that The Holy Ghost is a god of spirit and the messenger of the Father and Son; never doubt the resurrection of the dead, the immortality of the soul; that the destiny of man is eternal progress. Never again doubt that the mission of the Latter-day Saints is to all mankind, both the living and the dead; and that the great work in the holy temples for the living and the dead had only begun. Know this, that Joseph Smith was sent of God to usher in the gospel dispensation of the fullness of times, which is the last unto mortals upon the earth. His successors have all been called of and approved of God. President Heber J. Grant is at this time the recognized and ordained head of the Church of Jesus Christ upon the earth. Give him your confidence and support. Much you have seen and heard here you will not be permitted to repeat when you return." Thus saying he bade me "Good bye, and God bless you."

Quite a distance, through various scenes and passing innumerable people, I traveled before I reached the sphere which I had first entered. On my way I was greeted by many friends and relatives, certain of whom sent words of greeting and counsel to their dear ones here-my mother being one of them.

One other I will mention. I met brother John Adamson, his wife, his son James and their daughter Isabelle, all of whom were killed by the hand of a foul assassin in their home, at Carey, Idaho, in the evening of October 29, 1915. They seemed to define that I was on my way back to mortality and immediately said, (Brother Adamson was speaking) "Tell the children that we are very happy and very busy and they should not mourn our departure, nor worry their minds over the manner by which we were taken. There is purpose in it, and we have a work to do here which required our collective efforts, and which we could not do individually." I was at once made to know that the work referred to was that of genealogy on which they are working in England and Scotland.

One of the grandest and most sacred things of heaven is the family relationship. The establishment of the complete chain without any broken links brings a fullness of joy. Links wholly bad will be dropped out and either new links put in or the two adjoining links welded together. Men and women everywhere throughout the world are being moved upon by their departed ancestors to gather genealogies. These are the links for the chain. The ordinances of baptism, endowments, and sealings performed in the temples of God by the living for the dead are the welding of the links. Ordinances are performed in the spirit world effectualizing the individual recipient for their receiving the saving principles of the gospel vicariously performed here.

As I was approaching the place where I entered, my attention was attracted towards a number of small groups of women, preparing what appeared to me wearing apparel. Observing my inquiring countenance one of the women remarked, "We are preparing to receive Brother Phillip Worthington very soon." As I grasped his name in repetition I was admonished, "If you knew the joy and the glorious mission that awaits him here you would not ask to have him longer detained upon the earth." Then came flooding my consciousness this awful truth, that the will of the Lord can be done on earth as it in is heaven, only when we resign completely to His will and let His will be done in and through us. On account of the selfishness of many, persons who might have otherwise been taken in innocence and peace, have been permitted to live, and have lived to their own peril, men and the assertion of the personal will as against the will of God. Phillip Worthington died January 22, 1920, for which I was advised by telegram, and returning to Boise, preached his funeral sermon on January 25, 1920.

Men, women and children are often called to missions of great importance on the other side, and some respond gladly while others refuse to go and their loved ones will not give them up. Also, many die because they have not the faith to be healed. Others live and pass out of the world of mortals without any special manifestation of action of the divine will. When a man is stricken ill, the question of prime importance is not "Is he going to live, or Is he going to die?" What matter is it whether he lives or dies, so long as the will of the Father is done? Surely we can trust him with God. Herein lies the special duty and privilege of administration by the right and authority of the Holy Priesthood, namely: it is given the elders of the Church of Jesus Christ to divine the will of the Father concerning the one upon whose head their hands are laid. If for any reason they are unable to presage the Father's will, then they should continue to pray in faith for the afflicted one, humbly conceding supremacy to do the will of God, that His will may be done in earth as it in done in heaven.

To the righteous person, birth into the world of sprits is a glorious privilege and blessing. The greatest spirits in the family of the Father have not usually been permitted to tarry longer in the flesh than to perform a certain mission; then they are called to the world o f spirits where the field is greater and the workers fewer. This earthly mission, may therefore, be long or short, as the Father wills.

I passed quietly out where I had entered the world of spirits and immediately my body was quickened, and I was to ponder over and record the many wonderful things I had seen and heard.

Let me here and now declare to the world that irrespective of the opinion of others, I do know of my own positive knowledge and from my own personal experiences that God in the Father of the spirits of all men and that He lives; that Jesus Christ is his son and the Savior of the world, that the spirit of man does not die, but survives the change called death and goes to the world of spirits; that the world of spirit is upon or near this earth; that the principles of salvation are now being taught to the spirits and the great work of saving the Father's family among the living and dead is now in progress, and that but comparatively few will ultimately be lost; that spirits will literally take up their bodies again in the resurrection and that the gospel of Jesus Christ has again been established upon the earth with all of the keys, powers, authority, and blessings, through the instrumentality of the Prophet Joseph Smith; that His is the power that will not only save and exalt every one who yields obedience to its principles, but will ultimately save the world; that the burden of our mission is to save souls unto God, and that the work for the salvation of the dead is no less of importance than the work for the living."

Truth Tells Lucifer

I enjoyed reading this story (or vision or dream) of Heber Hale's.  Of course, it doesn't qualify as Scriptural but it was an interesting account that falls in line with those who have had near-death experiences. I have no reason to doubt the reality of his experience or his sincerity in relating it but I still would like some scriptural evidence either from the BOM, Holy Bible or D&C, POGP, the Ensign or the Koran. I really would like to gather some for my own persusal. Thanks for the story though.  
Satan is a great deceiver, the father of all lies, and has led well-meaning men to alter scriptures and can cause men and women to see visions or have dreams etc.  too.  I'm not saying that happened to Bro. Hale but it is definitely within the realm of possibility.

Lucifer Tells the Truth... Studies Doctrine Mormon

[quote]After studying the scriptures, I've concluded that   the Spirit World is a kind of resting place where we enjoy a deep restful dreamless sleep unaware of anything and unable to act - a kind of memory-tape where all of our existence is stored until we are awakened by the great shout of the angels - not an active place where we are aware and can move about etc - until the resurrection when we will be reunited with our bodies and come awake. All this notwithstanding the near-death experiences of so many who claim to have pierced the veil and had been counseled and sent back through the veil with more purpose to their lives.  Their experiences seem to tell us that there is indeed an active existence on the other side of the veil.  I'm ok with either but scripturally have difficulty with  the 'immediate active life on the other side of the veil'.  Perhaps someone can clue me in to some references about either the 'Spirit world' (not a description of it but it's actual existence as a place where we will become active immediately after death). Thanks. [/quote]

There are several scriptures that not only talks about the existence of the Spirit world but also that it's an active place where people move around doing things. Here is some scriptures:

1) 1 Peter 3: 18-20 "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just  for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put  to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
Bu which also HE WENT AND PREACHED UNTO THE SPIRITS IN PRISON; which sometime where disobedient, when once the long suffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."
In this particular scripture you can see that Christ visited the Spirit Prison (called also the Spirit world that consists in Paradise and Hell) AFTER his death and he PREACHED the Gospel to the people in there, now if the people in there are not aware of anything what would be the purpose of Christ going there to preach?.

2) 1 Peter 4:6 is another great example that the Spirit World is an active place.
"For for this cause was the gospel PREACHED also to them that are DEAD, that they might be JUDGED according to men in the FLESH, but live according to God in the Spirit."

3) You can also read the whole section of D & C 138. Let me just remark some of it starting from verse 11
" As I pondered over these things which are written , the eyes of my understanding were opened, and the Spirit of the Lord rested upon me, and I SAW THE HOSTS OF THE DEAD, BOTH SMALL AND GREAT.
AND THERE WERE GATHERED TOGETHER IN ONE PLACE AN INNUMERABLE COMPANY OF THE SPIRITS OF THE JUST, WHO HAD BEEN FAITHFUL IN THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS WHILE THEY LIVED IN MORTALITY....
ALL THESE HAD DEPARTED THE MORTAL LIFE, FIRM IN THE HOPE OF A GLORIOUS RESURRECTION, THROUGH THE GRACE OF GOD THE fATHER AND HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON, JESUS CHRIST.
I BEHELD THAT THEY WERE FILLED WITJ JOY AND GLADNESS, AND WERE REJOICING TOGETHER BECAUSE THE DAY OF THEIR DELIVERANCE WAS AT HAND.
THEY WERE ASSEMBLED AWAITING THE ADVENT OF THE SON OF GOD INTO THE SPIRIT WORLD, TO DECLARE THEIR REDEMPTION FROM THE BANDS OF DEATH.
THEIR SLEEPING DUST WAS TO BE RESTORED UNTO ITS PERFECT FRAME, BONE TO HIS BONE, AND THE SINEWS AND THE FLESH UPON THEM, THE SPIRIT AND THE BODY TO BE UNITED NEVER AFAIN TO BE DIVIDED, THAT THEY MIGHT RECEIVE A FULNESS OF JOY.
WHILE THISD VAST MULTITUDE WAITED AND CONVERSED, REJOICING IN THE HOUR OF THEIR DELIVERANCE FROM THE CHAINS OF DEATH, THE SON OF GOD APPEARED, DECLARING LIBERTY TO THE CAPTIVES WHO HAD BEN FAITHFULL AND THERE HE PREACHED TO THEM THE EVERLASTING GOSPEL, THE DOCTRINE OF THE RESURRECTION AND THE REDEMPTION OF MANKIND FROM THE FALL, AND FROM INDIVIDUAL SINS ON CONDITIONS OF REPENTANCE.....
AND THE SAINTS REJOICED IN THEIR REDEMPTION, AND BOWED THE KNEW AND ACKNOWLEDGED THE SON OF GOD AS THEIR REDEEMER AND DELIVERER FROM DEATH AND THE CHAINS OF HELL.
THEIR COUNTENANCES SHONE, AND THE RADIANCE FROM THE PRESENCE OF THE LORD RESTED UPON THEM, AND THEY SANG PRAISES UNTO HIS HOLY NAME"
Now, I started on verse 11 and jumped some verses, you can read the whole section 138. As you see, the spirits in the spirits prison are ver aware of what's going on and it is indeed a very active place where people can still repenting and change their ways.

Page 2 Truth Tells Lucifer

[quote]or the Koran. [/quote]
Quran? Why pray tell would you need proof from this book?

[quote]Satan is a great deceiver, the father of all lies, and has led well-meaning men to alter scriptures and can cause men and women to see visions or have dreams etc.  too.  I'm not saying that happened to Bro. Hale but it is definitely within the realm of possibility. [/quote]

Also, we must remember to say that Satan can deceive men is true, but then this would also apply to your post about the 'update' of the Ark of the Covenant. There is one clear element that you forgot about this vision... who requested it? The men of truth themselves... the First Presidency. As for scripture, well I think LDS_forever took care of that, but there are also the Discourses and Institute Manuals. The Spirit of Elijah (which is really another thread) is proof of the 'active work' of the other side. I have had many an instance that proved to me of the active participation of the living on the other side. I choose not to detail those experiences here (so that I may be blesse with more) but I do have them recorded for my prosperity.

Truth Tells Lucifer

The Quran because I believe it to be a divine revelation to a Prophet of God and is full of truth.  I respect it as Scripture just as much if not more than the Holy Bible.

I admit for sure that there is a possibility (albeit remote) Ron Wyatt  was deceived by Satan.  It would be hard to think so after reading his story completely. There is no magic, no illusions, no visions - only dried haploid blood samples that had spilled onto the Mercy Seat through the crack in the earth above it leading to the Cross post hole on which someone was crucified along with two others.  Wyatt's experience with the strange man who appeared near the top of a hilltop near their dig could be classified as supernatural and his interview with the Angels certainly would be considered pretty far out there but his videotape of the interview and the Ark and the work done in the Cavern where it is located will vindicate him when the time is right for the Ark to be revealed to the world.

I personally have had no visions or experiences like the one in the story.  It would be nice to be assured as Bro Hale that we could continue to be aware and live and be actively engaged immediately after death and the vastly larger realm of possibility that exists there - his is a great touching testimony and it makes sense to me but I suppose we will only really know when we awaken to the first resurrection. In the meantime, I do what I can to help bring myself and others back home in righteousness.
Thanks for the Scriptures LDS-Forever and the Testimony of Bro. Hale.  

Lucifer Tells the Truth...

[quote]The Quran because I believe it to be a divine revelation to a Prophet of God and is full of truth.  I respect it as Scripture just as much if not more than the Holy Bible. [/quote]

Before I give a reply it is necessary to ask you some questions which you may not wish to answer on this forum openly (you can send the answer by IM if you wish)...

1. Are you a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints?
2. Do you accept Jesus Christ as the Saviour and Redeemer of all mankind?
3. Do you believe Jesus Christ suffered and died and then rose on the third day?
4. Do you believe Joseph Smith as a Prophet of God?
5. Do yo believe the current Prophet, Gordon B. Hinckley, to be God's Prophet on the earth at this time? Do you believe him to be the only one to exercise all Keys of the Priesthood?
6. Do you believe the Book of Mormon to be the most correct book of any book on the earth?

Lucifer Tells Truth... - Page 2

Of course I am and of course I do.  They have nothing to do with how I feel about the Quran.  I'll wait for your response before I expound.

Lucifer Tells Truth... Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 2

[quote]The Quran because I believe it to be a divine revelation to a Prophet of God and is full of truth.  I respect it as Scripture just as much if not more than the Holy Bible. [/quote]
But do you know that as Latter-Day Saints we don't believe that the Quran is A DIVINE REVELATION from God?. We consider scripture ONLY  the Bible, the Book of Mormon, D&C and the Pearl of Great Price and of course, the words of the Prophet.  Believing that the Quran is a divine revelation for the muslims, it's okay, but not as members of the Church. Now, I can see why JB ask you some basic questions because it seems like your beliefs are not totally in agreement with the LDS doctrine. Just it's the case of what we are talking about right now and also the life after death issue, even though I quoted you the scriptures you asked for you don't seem convinced. Have you been in the Temple?, the whole session on the Temple  shows the great work that as Latter-day Saints we do for our dead ones, whom DECIDED to accept the Gospel in their lives. And as I mentioned before the whole section of D & C 138 is the perfect example.
I just want to ask you something without offend you, are you struggling with some LDS doctrine or do you really think that your believes are in perfect harmony with  the LDS doctrine?